Hudood Ordinance: Myths and Facts
Yesterday I got a good website link about Hudood Ordinance from Karachi metroblog website where a reader posted the link .In this website Mufti Taqi Usmani Shaab have comeup with a detailed examination of old and new hudood law.The article link is given here though still I would like add my own words as well.
Look first of all I believe that this issue has been brought up only to create confusion among illetrate Pakistanis about Islam.I used the word Illetrate rather uneducated because several degree holders are illetrate du to their mentality and lack of understanding about different matters.
There is a cabal among us who wishes to promotes secularism in Pakistan.Same cabal also labelled Quaid-e-Azam Muhammad Ali Jinnah a secularist as well though Jinnah never gave any such impression that he wanted a secular state.
The term Seclularism itself is very vague.In general secularism is treated as ‘Freedom of speech and adaption of a religion’ while reality is something else.
The world ’secular’ is a Latin word which means “In present world”.The term secularism itself was coined by George Jacob Holyoake in 1847 in order to describe a form of opinion which concerns itself only with questions,he issues of which can be tested by the experience of this life
Holyoake explains its further:
Secularism is that which seeks the development of the physical, moral, and intellectual nature of man to the highest possible point, as the immediate duty of life - which inculcates the practical sufficiency of natural morality apart from Atheism, Theism or the Bible - which selects as its methods of procedure the promotion of human improvement by material means, and proposes these positive agreements as the common bond of union, to all who would regulate life by reason and ennoble it by service” (Principles of Secularism, 17).
Once again the main source is “Materlism” rather sprituality which is against Aethism.Secondly Aethism doesn’t believe in hereafter concept given by all Abrahamic faiths.And other MOST important thing;Holyoake was an agonistic.
Therefore IMHO,Secularism is actually Aethism coated with few statments to make it vague.Charles Bradlaugh(1833-1891),the most powerful secularist of that time said in a public debate with Holyoake in 1870 said:
Although at present it may be perfectly true that all men who are Secularists are not Atheists, I put it that in my opinion the logical consequence of the acceptance of Secularism must be that the man gets to Atheism if he has brains enough to comprehend.
Many religion followers whether they re muslims,hindus,christians ,jews etc feel proud to be labelled as SECULARIST but if they do make a little effort,they will realise that they re intentially or unintentially being Anti-God.I am specially adressing to Muslims now that Please do realise wht you talk about rather being a copycat jerk of West.Secularism is NOT about giving freedom of religion.Do repent to Allah!Our Pakistanis dont even hesitate to label Jinnah as secular.I was in discussion with few guys on Adil’s blog where they gave Fatwa that Jinnah is a secular due to his speech in which he said that every Pakistani is free to follow his religion.Does that make one secularist?Even Quran says similar in Surah Kafiroon Lakum Denokum Waliyadeen( You have your path and I have mine.).Does this mean its secularism?I already explained what actually is secularism which has NOTHING to do with freedom at all.
Ok lets suppose that secularism is all about laws which have no influence of religion and it gives freedom. Now on paper
The reason I involved secularism in my Hudood Post that many desi secularists consider this law is a ‘prison’ for Pakistani Women and for them the solution of all problems is Secularism which is promoted by Pakistani Muslims as well. The detail commentary is given by Usmani sahib in the article but I would discuss one or two funny parts of these amendments.
Who can file a complaint of Qazf? Source
a)if the person in respect of whom the Qazf has been committed is alive, that person or any person authorized by him therefore Amendment Commission came up with an absurd statmemt;please read:
It is obvious from the wording used in this clause that the drafters of this law overlooked and completely ignored women. exclusion of term ‘her’ means that is only a main against whom Qazf is committed is eligible to file a complaint
Now it really gave me laugh. I am not a law student but even in general speaking we use such masculine terms to cover both male and female.
If a teacher orders to student in Urdu Koi class se bahar nahi jaye ga! , Does it mean that it was for MALE students only?Ah!! Secularists and their lame theories.
Do read another clause which clears how sincere they are to Protect Women.
I personally didn’t give a damn to such developments. Don’t I say right that this issue is nothing but to create confusion among muslims?They were never serious to resolve the issue.If they are really serious,why don’t they hang fudals who always commit crime of KaroKari ,Wanni and others against Women?
Further read: Transcript of Zara Sochiye
Tagged:Secularism,Secular,Hudood Ordinance,Islam,Shariah
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September 10th, 2006 at 12:02 am
I read the artical by Mufti taqi usmani and I have no doubt about how great this law can be provided we had intentions of implementing it in our country justly…..but the fact is that the law in pakistan is different for different classes…..the elites are involved in all kinds of immoral acts from drinking to robbing to adultery and it is happening openly but huddod has only been applied to the poor. Now thats where this law can be and is misused…..as taqi sahab said that in one case the father filed a report of adultery against his own daughter and we know in our society what it means, yet she was set free….excuse me……this society has karo kari,this society has incest and molestation…..how can we expect the father to be so honourable…..it has nothing to do with secularism but with the implementation of this law that raises eyebrows….when people like altaf, zardari, nawaz, benazir and musharaf who crossed all hudoods set by allah then we know that the implementation of this law will be a mockery…..Jinah by the way was hardly a muslim….if alcohol consumption is a crime then the founder of the nation committed that crime openly….so where does that leave us…..I think first we need to bring a change in the character and composition of our society before bringing laws becuse until society changes and evolves for better no law can provide security or strength to people…….one more thing adnan….you said,”I used the word Illiterate rather uneducated because several degree holders are illiterate due to their mentality and lack of understanding about different matters.”……well it should’ve been ….. people are literate but uneducated means…. they can read but have no knowledge of religious matters….degree holders are literate but unaware….and coming back to the hudood ordinance and secularism…..I am living in Singapore at the moment which claims to be a secular state but i have never felt this safe in my own country….even the domestic workers here can go and lodge a report and expect to get the justice…unlike saudi arabia or many gulf states where we have islamic laws…my point is that not always should we have a conspiracy theory about the west or such debates which challenge the status quo…….we need to understand that without justice in our society huddod ordinance is just another law which will be used by the people to expoit the masses….nobody will ever touch the elites, lords and political terrorists.
September 10th, 2006 at 5:41 am
I see a secular society as one that values reason and free thought.
A secular society is one in which people have the right to be religious, or to not be religious.
A secular society bases it’s laws in reason. A theocracy or religious state bases it’s laws in religious beliefs, which may or may not be rational or reasonable.
Dominionism, The Other Autocratic Regime
http://beepbeepitsme.blogspot.com/2006/09/dominionism-other-autocratic-regime.html
September 10th, 2006 at 12:27 pm
@Beep:you are still preaching about secular society?
I see a secular society as one that values reason and free thought
SHOW ME just ONE secular society on earth!!!
I already explained what actually is secularism which is aethism in reality and it has nothing to do with freedom.I personally wil not value your comments more than fathers of secularism which already covered in my post.
Secular is fictitious and on paper only like Evolution.Nothing reality.None of them was practically tested
September 10th, 2006 at 12:31 pm
it has nothing to do with secularism
Saima:Bibi you are very naive.As i said that these ammendments has NOTHNIG TO DO WITH WOMEN PROTECTION NEITHER ITS THEIR AIM.It was all about creating a fuss and confusion among “jahil” Pakistanis(jahil includes degree holders as well) about Islam nothing else.I wouldnt want to buy theory that they were sincere about women protection ,specially after points raised by Taqi Sahab.
Do i share with you that there are rumors that govt or ngos are working on a law to allow alcohol legally in Pakistan by taking support of ‘Islam’ ?
September 10th, 2006 at 5:17 pm
When did i say that the ngos or the Govt. is sincere about the protection of women, niether did i say that women are protected well in secular states….my point was that… to protect women we need to change the fabric of our society….it needs to be educated so that we have society which respects each other’s life and property and this cannot be done by any law…..religious parties and teachers need to educate people instead of fighting a war of words when they have failed the very people so many times in the past…….i said earlier in my post that women are protected quite well in the secular states not because of the lack of religion but because of the presence of accountability and social justice…….and Adnan govt. doesn’t have to have a law for the alcohol……as it is easily available to the rich and well placed…this law is for the masses and they don’t care about the masses…..if we want to protect our women in pakistan we need to educate our men in pakistan about their responsibilies towards their women…….otherwise no law can guarantee protection……
September 10th, 2006 at 10:20 pm
Saima,bibi you are being so vocal that you are keep ignoring what i mentioned in my post.You said:
, niether did i say that women are protected well in secular states
Which friggin SECULAR state?Show me one Secular State on earth.USA?India.I can refute you easilt for these states,name others,European countries?Pretty influenced of Catholism over there.China,Russia etc?Communism rocks!!
What is left?Africa ,Asia?which state are you talking about.I clearly said:
There is No Secular State on Earth and I dont belive in your definition of secularism which is a LIE.You ignore the fact and history of secularism.Search the name of people I mentioned in my post like Holyoake and his defitnion.it had nothing to do with FREEDOM and it was all about supporting Aethism
Please read ,read and read before you just make a post.
.and Adnan govt. doesn’t have to have a law for the alcohol……as it is easily available to the rich and well placed
You clearly lack something.According to you if something is Easily available then law is not required.Lady can you make a difference between something available legally and in access vs Illegally and in lesser quantity.
What what..I just read your first ever comment on this thread.You said:
Jinah by the way was hardly a muslim….
WTF are you talking about.What is the proof?Dont tell me he was a secularist.Comeup with proof
if alcohol consumption is a crime then the founder of the nation committed that crime openly
ARe you Ok?What are you trying to say that Jinnah was alcholic?comeup with proof
September 10th, 2006 at 10:24 pm
And Saima remember one thing before you answer me.For me a secularist is an actually an aethist.Thts what the foundation of secularism too and Secularism has no association with religion that is a person could be either a religion follower or an aethist/secular.There is no such thing in reality like Muslim Secularists,Christian secularists etc.
I really feel pitty for our so called *educated* class.
P.S:are you a secularists?If yes then you clearly know my views about them.So do prepare yourself before you throw any reply
September 10th, 2006 at 10:40 pm
Maybe you are also a victom of pathetic media tactics like this
Maybe you also believe in theory of goerge?
I really loathe such people who just blindly get agreed to say any crap against anyone.
I expect you to comeup with proof against Jinnah and other things I asked.
September 11th, 2006 at 7:26 am
The shariah is enforced to various definitions in many islamic countries. Saudia, iran, pakistan, talibanistan to remind you of the most notorious. It continues to fail the defenceless everywhere. Man made laws in the west might not be perfect but hey trump shariah in every case when it comes to protecting people and safeguarding everyones rights.
September 11th, 2006 at 9:52 am
I dont know what do you mean by shariah but if shariah means chopping hands,banning ladies driving in saudia,banning ladies education by taliban(I supported it due to genuine reason at that time in the region) then my friend you are wrong.Shariah is not name of few factors and if you really want to know about shariah then read biographies of 1st four caliphs ,bio of Umar bin Abdul Aziz(RA) and few more then you would learn what actually is Shariah.
You guys believe in Islam presented by West.The west which consider Jihad means Holywar and Fatwa means “Death orders” and its pretty absurd.More lame that our own people believe in it.These people always tried to prove themself “educated”.
September 12th, 2006 at 5:16 pm
i had left a detailed answer here but seems you never got my reply….so i have left a short answer with the jinah post
September 13th, 2006 at 6:46 am
Sir
you need to understand the difference between secular govts. and secular people….the word secular is used more for the govts. because they have to run a country with many religions and thus the need for impartiality arise…..but no one ever claimed that the personal biases are absent in secular govts. It is just easier to hold them accountable if one group is aggrieved…..
September 13th, 2006 at 10:20 am
you need to understand the difference between secular govts. and secular people.
Every govt is run by people what do you try to tell me?A govt would be secular or religious only if their main administrators believ in concept.You cant expect an aethist to follow shariah neither u can except a religon follower to obey aethism.
because they have to run a country with many religions and thus the need for impartiality arise
Do you put Islam in line of Christianity and Judaism?Do you know why the concept of church and state was brought up.I have given a detailed answer here:
http://pakistaniat.com/2006/09/10/pakistan-hudood-ordinance-women-rights-islam/
and not willing to repeat that why sepration of church and state was necessary at that time.Read my last 4 replies,which stats after umera’s post.if you face difficulty,let me know.
but no one ever claimed that the personal biases are absent in secular govts. It is just easier to hold them accountable if one group is aggrieved
Just on papers not in reality
October 28th, 2007 at 4:34 pm
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